5

Here is what I have research so far.

Aghanim's Scepter (4200 gold)

  • 390 health, 0.3 health regeneration, 1.4 armor, 10 attack speed, 280 mana, 0.4 mana regeneration and 10 attack damage.
  • FINGER OF DEATH benefit
    • reduce 25 mana cost (?)
    • cooldown 20 second
    • AOE 200
    • increase dmg 175

Dagon ( 2720/3970/5220/6470/7720 gold)

  • On level 1, it grants a total of 57 health, 0.09 health regeneration, 0.42 armor, 3 attack speed, 208 mana, 0.64 mana regeneration and 12 (25 to intelligence heroes) attack damage.
  • On level 2, it grants a total of 57 health, 0.09 health regeneration, 0.42 armor, 3 attack speed, 247 mana, 0.76 mana regeneration and 12 (28 to intelligence heroes) attack damage.
  • On level 3, it grants a total of 57 health, 0.09 health regeneration, 0.42 armor, 3 attack speed, 286 mana, 0.88 mana regeneration and 12 (31 to intelligence heroes) attack damage.
  • On level 4, it grants a total of 57 health, 0.09 health regeneration, 0.42 armor, 3 attack speed, 325 mana, 1.00 mana regeneration and 12 (34 to intelligence heroes) attack damage.
  • On level 5, it grants a total of 57 health, 0.09 health regeneration, 0.42 armor, 3 attack speed, 364 mana, 1.12 mana regeneration and 12 (37 to intelligence heroes) attack damage.
  • Active ability: 400 / 500 / 600 / 700 / 800 magic damage at 600 / 650 / 700 / 750 / 800 range , 35 30 25 20 15 second cooldown , 180 mana

As I see on Ti5, Lion go for Dagon. They also said that Lion with Dagon have 80% win rate.

However, in many of my game, I would like to have scepter because the AOE damage and low cooldown look nice. I also need 390 health from scepter because Lion have low base HP.

On dotabuff, http://www.dotabuff.com/heroes/lion , in "Most used item" list, Aghanim's Scepter at 3rd.

I need your advice.

Added: I just try go for Dagon level 2 then Aghanim's Scepter. Dagon give good 1 second kill on early mid game. The Aghanim's Scepter give small AOE damage which I found that useful against range hero with illusion like Terrorblade or Traxex with Manta (because range hero and illusion usually stick together) which my finger can damage hero and clear illusion at once, leave only real hero for Dagon.

  • Are you asking which would be best to use, for you? – Jeeva Sep 18 '15 at 9:42
  • You can do a lot of calculating the damage per mana output against gold and whatnot, but I think aghs is a no brainer over dagon because of the stats and buildup you'll get. Lion is a squishy hero, low base health, and often played as a support (less gold). Getting an ogre club while you're spending a lot of money on wards is a lot better than getting no more survivability from a dagon's staff of wizardry – enche Sep 23 '15 at 13:30
7

Both Dagon and Aghanim's play good on Lion.

Consider this situation: is it possible to get all the heroes within 200 aoe (highly impossible unless you have magnus or enigma), you are usually doing just 1025 (neglect magic resistance) but if you have max Dagon you'll do 850+800=1650 which is more than enough to kill heroes with low hp.

But Dagon comes at very high price -- but costs less mana to cast 180, while FoD needs 625, which may starve you for mana during team fights since you probably won't be able to use mana drain.

Maybe lvl 3 Dagon and then go for Aghanims is a better idea. However, in the end, it just comes down to situation and team composition.

  • 1
    If you're comparing damage between only aghs and only dagon, your math is a little off. Building dagon instead of aghs would be 850 + 800 = 1650. It'd also be good to consider that Dagon 2 costs about the same as Aghs, which would be 850 + 500 = 1350 (compared to 1025), meanwhile you're taking a hit on survivability with 300 less HP and 1 less armor. – Will Eddins Sep 18 '15 at 15:52
  • Ty,,, edited the answer :) – Lokanath Sep 18 '15 at 16:17
4

Maybe this answer is a Little bit too late, but I would like to add something to Lokanath's answer.

I personally would strongly recommend Aghanim's on Lion, mostly because of the farming potential. You can stack a big jungle camp, clear it instantly with your ult and go the next camp to recover your mana. That's about 300 gold in 15 seconds (alternatively you can find a big creep wave which can give you even more gold). If you want your dagon afterwards, you will get it much faster.

If you want to increase your damage potential, you can also go for a Veil of Discord (which costs about the same as dagon). It adds 25% to ALL magic damage (not only yours) on a pretty huge area (not a single target) and can be casted almost permanently (16 sec Duration, 20 sec Cooldown). Imho, that makes even Veil better than Dagon since it also provides better stats than Dagon (more HP, more armor and HP-regen).

Additionally, I don't know when I have seen a dagon on Lion in one of my games. Normally, they get Dagger and MAYBE an Agh's before the game is over, but that is rather rare. But just the Point Booster is often a big item in terms of survivability.

If you really want to go for Dagon, I recommend just to go for Dagon Level 1, the Upgrades are rarely effective (1250 gold for a little improvement in range and cooldown and 100 damage (minus reduction), man that's not worth lacking a Point Booster). An upgrade from Dagon Level 1 to Dagon Level 5 is a whole Aghanim's!!

"They also said that Lion with Dagon have 80% win rate." Statistics are the mathematical form of a lie. For such rather unusual builds, it is always worth, checking a bit on the Backgrounds. 80% in this context sounds like 4 out of 5 to me. If that's the case, Forget that statistics. Those games were probably either snowballing or the dagon was purchased when the game was actually over.

  • Aghanim's with AOE and 20 sec cd farm very well. However, i would rather left stack for my carrier and go ganking. – Haha TTpro Sep 19 '15 at 14:31
  • Aghs is also good for waveclear when pushing or defending. – StingyJack Nov 10 '15 at 19:38
  • 1
    "They also said that Lion with Dagon have 80% win rate." - I second your sceptism. Dotabuff stats over this week (no link because it will be outdated soon) say a Lion carrying Aegis has a staggering 98% winrate. Winrate will tell you something about heroes and builds, but not about items (where timing matters much) – antipattern Nov 19 '15 at 15:48

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