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I'm new to the game, and am on my first playthrough where I've successfully become the King of Ireland. I've been eyeing up the title of King of Brittany, but I'm not sure of the best way to take it.

I've tried one plan, where I married my sister matrilineally to a courtier with a claim on the Duchy of Briezh (same territory). I've pressed the claim and won the war, so now the courtier is Duke, and my dynasty will take charge next generation. Although, I've realized this doesn't really help me - my nephew will become Duke of Briezh, vassal to the current King of Brittany, instead of me.

Even if I find someone with a claim on the Kingship itself, if I press his claim, he'll just become King of Brittany when I win, and still won't be part of Ireland. I suppose I'd have great relations with the Kingdom of Brittany, but I want that land for myself!

How can I take this second kingdom for myself and become King of Ireland and King of Brittany? Do I need to ask the Pope for some help? Marry into the royal family itself and eliminate the other heirs? Fabricate claims and take the kingdom county by county? Is there any way for me to get a claim on the kingship myself?

  • In order to have a kingdom that belongs to you as a vassal you must be an emperor. If you want to claim the kingdom for yourself, you must either have a claim to the kingdom itself (not the regions) or have all the lands in your realm and create/usurp the title like any other title. In this case even if your family member was the only heir, they would leave your court and found their own as you would not have a greater title than theirs – nickson104 Jun 28 '17 at 13:47
  • Playing as Ireland, I noticed that the heir to the most powerful Scottish region (I forget the name) is very much hated by his own wife and mother. I married my son to the heir's younger (oldest) sister; convinced the mother and wife to assassinate the heir; and all I needed to do then was wait for the current ruler to die of old age. – Flater Jun 29 '17 at 12:12
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There are several different way of doing it.

I am assuming that the actual kingdom of Brittany title hasn't been created as of yet. Because if it already exists then you would just have to usurp it from the current owner through most of the same steps.

1) find a weak military Duke that own a title within De Jure Brittany. Start fabricate a claim on that Duke or alternative arrange a marriage where the title would eventually end up under your control (longer way but possible quicker with enough murder).

2) Repeat step 1 until you have at least 3 or 4 titles within De Jure of Brittany (in the rare case it isn't the normal 6 country due to De Jure changing then you need 2/3 of the titles).

3) If there is a King already for Brittany. Then usurp his title so you become the De Jure King. If it doesn't exist. Then you need to create it.

4) Make sure your newly acquired Kingdom of Brittany has law of succession to your liking. Otherwise it may fall to someone beyond your control soonly afterward if you are not careful especially if it is elective type succession.

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  • If I take a county in step 1 by fabricating a claim, I assume I become the ruler of that county, and that the county is no longer a part of the (remaining) Duchy of Breizh and the Kingdom of Brittany? Are they just independent counties held by me, or are they a part of the Kingdom of Ireland, or what? – Nuclear Wang Jun 28 '17 at 19:27
  • I had an awkward situation where I manage to inherit a country within France Kingdom into England's main title without meaning to. The weird part was that said Heir was a minor Duke within England Kingdom and he managed to marry into a France Duke title. My king died and he become the king and since king can't be vassal of another king. So that said country seceded from France as a consequence. Which allow king of France to declare de jure war on me because he was still king of de jure France. Just because a king exist doesn't meant titles within kingdom will stay with the King. Make sense? – Vyndicu Jun 29 '17 at 12:56
  • @NuclearWang In step 1 you want to fabricate a claim on a duke title not a county title, otherwise you going to have to repeat that step a lot more times. – user86571 Jun 29 '17 at 17:19
  • Yeah the problem is in a few start, especially the earliest one, the actual Duke/Kingdom Title doesn't exist yet. So you would still have to do step 1 repeatedly regardless. Sure it would be nice to just seize the king/duke title in one go if it exists. – Vyndicu Jun 29 '17 at 17:40
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You can try to get your heir to inherit both titles. You can do that by pressing your spouse's claim on England.

This method works if both Ireland and Brittany have some hereditary succession law, which they should have by default. It also won't work if England has a pure-agnatic succession and you are a man.

  1. Marry someone with a claim to the Kingdom of Brittany. This should be someone who does not give you a non-aggression pact with the king of Brittany (unless he is likely to die soon). You can find claimants by clicking on the "Claimants" button of the title window. Keep in mind, though, that weak claims can only be pressed against regencies, so get someone with a strong claim if possible.
  2. Have a heir with your spouse. If your spouse already has sons from an earlier marriage, they need to die.
  3. Press your spouse's claim on Brittany in a war. Alternatively, if the claim can be inherited, wait until your spouse dies and press the claim as/for your heir (this might be necessary in some cases when you married a woman).
  4. Win that war

Your spouse will become Queen/King of Brittany, which will make them an independent for now. But your heir will inherit both kingdoms when you two die. Steps 3 and 4 can of course be skipped if you manage to marry the actual heir to the English throne, but that's unlikely.

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    I think by England and the English throne you really mean Brittany and the throne of Brittany (or the Breton throne). Brittany (also known historically as Little Britain) is a kingdom in the northwest of modern day France. – user86571 Jun 29 '17 at 4:46
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Assuming from your question:

There is already a Kingdom of Brittany, you are king or Ireland, your relative is a Duke of Breizh, vassal to the crown of Brittany.

You can, of course, forfeit your earlier machinations and take the kingdom as usual: fabricate a claim on the duchy or a majority of counties in it (or ask the Pope if the target is Catholic - not always the case with that particular peninsula), conquest, usurp.

The second option is slightly more involved - since the target duchy is now controlled by your dynasty, they won't get fussy about matrilinear marriage with your ruling house - meaning that if you are ready to elect a female ruler for your next generation, you can just betrothal her to the next Duke. In two generations, the duchy is yours. This assumes you can actually elect heirs.

The third option, which you probably wanted to go for in the first place, is to get somebody with a claim to the duchy in your court. The thing about claim wars is that sometimes the target becomes your vassal, sometimes they don't. The exact conditions of that you can Google, but the main 3 are:

  • the claimant is of your dynasty
  • you are the de jure liege of the territory
  • the claimant is already your vassal (not just a courtier).

So what you had to do was wait out that generation, until the children of the original claimant had the claim, THEN go to war. This way, since the children are of your dynasty, they also become your vassals. If the original claimants claim was not inheritable, you can make it inheritable by going to war with it, pressing for white peace after obliterating their army, then killing off the claimant after he has children.

Good news though - since the little princes will be of your dynasty, religion and culture, they are likely to join your court if invited and will have claims. The Duke is unlikely to have enough lands to give to all of them. So you just have to wait until the new Duke of Brittany has had enough fun with his wife, his heirs are of age, court them and do some conquering.

In any case, once you have the full Duchy, it just takes some gold to usurp the Kingdom.

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