Primeval Force gives 5% elemental penetration, and also Forces of Nature has 6% elemental penetration. If I'm already going for Primeval Force, how should I value also taking FoN if its nearby - is it better to stack penetration, or just a little bit goes a long way and adding more will give diminishing returns?

Does the value of getting FoN change if other cluster nodes are also considered (FoN cluster gives less bonus than PF).

  • I'm afraid that "desirability" makes the question opinion-based (what's desirable for you might not be for me). it all depends on how many passive skill points you want/can spend.
    – Federico
    Jun 8, 2018 at 13:16
  • Elemental penetration has indeed diminishing return once the enemy's resistance is below 0. This cannot be answered without knowing your exact tree, items, skills. The best thing to do is compare neighbour nodes on Path of Building. Jun 8, 2018 at 15:11
  • @Federico Changed it to value instead. While the exact circumstances are surely subjective based on tree etc., there should be some rationale for how people think that a particular cluster is worth going for.
    – Alok
    Jun 8, 2018 at 21:46

1 Answer 1


Primeval Force gives 5% elemental penetration, and also Forces of Nature has 6% elemental penetration.

These values are pretty small. They're included more for flavor than for their game impact.

Both Primeval Force and Forces of Nature are primarily weapon/attack elemental damage nodes. Notice that the minor passives leading up to Forces of Nature both grant Weapon Elemental Damage, and the two paths leading to Primeval Force grant Weapon Elemental Damage and Elemental Damage with Attack Skills, respectively. You are expected to pick these notables for the elemental damage, not for the penetration. If your build does not benefit from the elemental damage, you are wasting skill points by pathing to them.

If you need elemental penetration, use an [Element] Penetration Support gem (which grants up to 37% penetration of its element when fully leveled), or a unique item which provides penetration of the appropriate element.

  • 3
    11% penetration is anywhere from 11% more damage to 44% more damage depending on the targets resistances. It's certainly not a small value especially dealing with end game content. Shaper for example has 40% res and the 11% pen would be 18% more damage. Jun 16, 2018 at 1:30
  • @VanBuzzKill At the cost of 7+ skill points, though? There's certain to be better ways of allocating that.
    – user86277
    Jun 16, 2018 at 4:07
  • They give other bonuses as well as you've said. If you're going weapon elemental you might as well get those nodes. Primeval Force alone is 56% (+20% during flasks) increased elemental with weapons. Add the other cluster that's another 40% for 116% total and the 11% penetration. Jun 16, 2018 at 5:19
  • @VanBuzzKill Right, like I said, if your build depends on weapon elemental damage, then those modifiers would be enough reason alone to allocate those passives. The elemental penetration is a nice little bonus, but you'd probably still pick those passives without it.
    – user86277
    Jun 16, 2018 at 5:23

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